71006 - The Simpsons House

[HarryG]

Unfortunately... 3.66kg of Lego and 3.66kg of MegaBollocks weighs the same! ;-)

I can imagine a guy opening one in 5 years from now having paid a decent amount and going into a rage over MegaBloks hahaha

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[Ed Mack]

Let me offer another possible scenario. It is possible he could have been one of the many who come here. Never posted, never did research and disillusioned by the culture of easy money fast that one can get from this site. He purchased the sets with money he couldn't spare hoping for an OOS quick flip. That obviously didn't happen. Now he needs money fast. Goes to CL because of its ease and no fees. Cuts his losses and makes a quick firesale.

I agree this deal does sound shady. But it is possible that some of these deals are because somebody jumped in too quick and suddenly realized this ian not for them.

I was thinking along these lines...or a stolen credit card scenario.  The Simpsons House is not available from non-LEGO sources...yet, so he would have had to order from S@H or picked one up at a LEGO store, so they aren't walking out the backdoor of a Target or Walmart.  This could be an example of a failed LEGO investor who needs money quick for daily necessities.  You will see this happening more and more, especially if the economy and jobs situation in the US doesn't drastically improve.  Money is tight for most of us right now, so I can see this scenario playing out.  

 

Speaking for myself, it's a very good chance that I have received merchandise that was probably stolen over the past 7-8 years of collecting, mainly in my early days of collecting when I had zero idea what illegal drop shipping was.  I avoid these "too good to be true" deals now.  I am also certain that I have taken advantage of other people's misfortunes and have scored some fantastic deals because people needed money to pay their "real" bills.  I do not pretend to be an angel, but I do not break the law.  If a store posts a ridiculously low price, I will take advantage of it, I would be stupid not to.  I'm sure most of you have had similar experiences and views.  

 

I really don't want this thread to turn into a morality tale.  It is easy to cast stones on the internet and many who preach are the biggest offenders.  The whole business of LEGO investing and reselling has no right or wrong, black or white, methods or philosophies...only shades of grey.  One can argue that reselling LEGO in itself is against LEGO's wishes, but that's for another thread.  Just my two cents...

[Guest TabbyBoy]

The 71006 is no longer an exclusive!  In the UK, Smyths Toys & TRU are getting them in next month with John Lewis to follow soon after. If anyone has bought hundreds of items off eBay, the chances are that you have handled stolen property - hopefully unknowingly.  I've been selling CITY sets dirt cheap and I've already been asked if the sets are nicked, I just don't bother replying to those that ask such stupid questions.  As if I'm going to say "Yes!"

 

My best haul was 67x 41999s at well under RRP as the buyer was getting divorced (or so I was told) and needed the cash within 48 hrs.  I drove straight up to Birmingham the morning after (100 miles) to meet him with fresh

[vincevaughn]

The 71006 is no longer an exclusive! In the UK, Smyths Toys & TRU are getting them in next month with John Lewis to follow soon after. If anyone has bought hundreds of items off eBay, the chances are that you have handled stolen property - hopefully unknowingly. I've been selling CITY sets dirt cheap and I've already been asked if the sets are nicked, I just don't bother replying to those that ask such stupid questions. As if I'm going to say "Yes!"

My best haul was 67x 41999s at well under RRP as the buyer was getting divorced (or so I was told) and needed the cash within 48 hrs. I drove straight up to Birmingham the morning after (100 miles) to meet him with fresh

[@rtisan]

67 41999s? You`ve posted some impressive hauls in the past, but damn, that`s pretty great!

 

Love the part about the divorce. He`s selling to pay for lawyers. They`ll give ya a great ROI!

[Guest TabbyBoy]

Wait 67 of the exclusive crawlers....was it suitcase of cash you brought with you?

 

250x crisp

[M4x18]

Well there you go, when you get 67 Crawlers you also get a divorce

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[biniou]

Wait 67 of the exclusive crawlers....was it suitcase of cash you brought with you?

And a big shopping bag to bring back the boxes.

[naf]

What's strange is we have people on this site who abuse coupons, take advantage of obvious pricing errors, or gladly rip of uunknowing people on Craigslist who aren't asking enough for their item.

But, they seem to think that buying a "possible", stolen item is somehow taboo.

 

I don't understand how people can "take advantage" of coupons.  If a company produces a coupon, and allows things like stacking to get a better deal, how is that wrong or immoral on the part of the buyer?   Same goes for pricing errors.  Take the target MHC for example.  We speculate that it was a pricing error, but will we really ever know?  Perhaps target just wanted to get rid of a bunch of them.  This is different than buying goods from some guy in a back alley at a huge discount you know is too good to be true.

 

Don't open the boxes. The chances that they have been tampered with are waaaaaay lower than the chances that the guy just got them cheap from a sketchy source. Others are saying you should decline just in case they're stolen, but I think you should buy them and fist-pump all the way home. You have no idea where he got them, and it's not your responsibility to find out. Is it possible that they're stolen? Sure. It might even be probable. But as long as you don't know, you haven't done anything wrong. Are you going to do a background check on every single Craigslister you buy from? Of course not. Everything you buy could be stolen. If I buy a hot dog from a vendor on the street, it could be a stolen weiner. I have no idea, but it's not my responsibility to find out.

 

If you want to take a moral stance on it because it might be stolen goods, then you have my admiration. Just give the guy my user ID and tell him I'll send some business his way. ;-)

 

The police have a different opinion than you do.  Receiving stolen goods, whether you know it or not, is illegal.  Ignorance of the law will not help you.  At the very least, if the cops track down the stolen property, they will take it as evidence and you're out all of your money.

[dubels]

I don't understand how people can "take advantage" of coupons.  If a company produces a coupon, and allows things like stacking to get a better deal, how is that wrong or immoral on the part of the buyer?   Same goes for pricing errors.  Take the target MHC for example.  We speculate that it was a pricing error, but will we really ever know?  Perhaps target just wanted to get rid of a bunch of them.  This is different than buying goods from some guy in a back alley at a huge discount you know is too good to be true.

 

 

The police have a different opinion than you do.  Receiving stolen goods, whether you know it or not, is illegal.  Ignorance of the law will not help you.  At the very least, if the cops track down the stolen property, they will take it as evidence and you're out all of your money.

 

You are partially correct. A person will not face criminal prosecution for the receipt of stolen items unless they knowingly received stolen goods. Its not ignorance of the law, criminal law requires at the most basic level a criminal intent and a criminal act. If someone is taking advantage of someone's bad luck with car repairs the criminal intent to receive stolen property is not there. Even if the DAs office had the resources to pursue this person, they would have a hard time proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, and even if they did it would be unproductive anyways.

 

The part you are correct on is that if the cops can prove through a tracing method that the items were stolen they have the right to retake the property without any compensation to the party that unknowingly received the stolen goods. However, the person has a claim against the estate of the party he bought the items from.

 

At the time of purchase I had no real reason to question his source. His car broke down, he needs a car for work, and he does not know a lot about legos. He even said his original intentions was to sit on two sets to sell later and keep one for himself. If I couldn't get to my job because of a broken down car I would take a loss on my legos in a heartbeat to fix my car. Yes, he could have sold them for a higher price, but his posting was up already for 3 days and it seemed like it was his first time selling on craigslist.

 

TL:DR: Never really came to mind that the items could have been stolen. I was scared of being robbed or scammed more than anything because of certain things before and during the transaction that raised red flags for my safety but not the source of the goods.

[legoman12323123]

Let me offer another possible scenario. It is possible he could have been one of the many who come here. Never posted, never did research and disillusioned by the culture of easy money fast that one can get from this site. He purchased the sets with money he couldn't spare hoping for an OOS quick flip. That obviously didn't happen. Now he needs money fast. Goes to CL because of its ease and no fees. Cuts his losses and makes a quick firesale.

I agree this deal does sound shady. But it is possible that some of these deals are because somebody jumped in too quick and suddenly realized this ian not for them.

 Why couldnt he just return it with receipt if it was legit? He had 90 days .. if he really used money he couldnt spare any logical person would have returned it within the 90 days.

[dubels]

3660 grams

(+/- 5 grams)

Just weighed it with a cheap harbor freight scale and all boxes weighed in at 3688grams. Should I be worried? I wish Lego would use better tamper seals. Like ones that leave a mark after they are removed. All the seals look better than the ones on the Daily Bugle I received from Kmart today. Since I am keeping two to sell at a later date I just want to make sure to save the future buyer and myself some headache.

 

 

 

 Why couldnt he just return it with receipt if it was legit? He had 90 days .. if he really used money he couldnt spare any logical person would have returned it within the 90 days.

 

He said he purchased them off of a friend.

[Ed Mack]

Just weighed it with a cheap harbor freight scale and all boxes weighed in at 3688grams. Should I be worried? I wish Lego would use better tamper seals. Like ones that leave a mark after they are removed. All the seals look better than the ones on the Daily Bugle I received from Kmart today. Since I am keeping two to sell at a later date I just want to make sure to save the future buyer and myself some headache.

 

 

 

 

He said he purchased them off of a friend.

Save yourself some trouble.  Open up the seals and confirm the contents.  It will really cost very little in resale value and at least you know you have all the bags.  

[Migration]

The 71006 is no longer an exclusive!  In the UK, Smyths Toys & TRU are getting them in next month with John Lewis to follow soon after. If anyone has bought hundreds of items off eBay, the chances are that you have handled stolen property - hopefully unknowingly.  I've been selling CITY sets dirt cheap and I've already been asked if the sets are nicked, I just don't bother replying to those that ask such stupid questions.  As if I'm going to say "Yes!"

 

My best haul was 67x 41999s at well under RRP as the buyer was getting divorced (or so I was told) and needed the cash within 48 hrs.  I drove straight up to Birmingham the morning after (100 miles) to meet him with fresh

[dubels]

Caved and opened a box. Everything is there.

[JRandall]

Buying potentially (illegally purchased or stolen) makes everyone on the site look bad.  These aren't anything to be proud about unless the person is liquidating their collection of which this obviously isn't the case.

[dubels]

Please just close this thread. As it appears its just morally offensive to so many who live on their high horses who have never bought anything that could have once been stolen. Unlike the law, it appears to be guilty until proven innocent. I am sure me buying it as opposed to another person that post on a different site makes such a huge difference.

 

Give me a break. Even if you have never bought a deal that was TGBT it doesn't mean you have not unknowingly received stolen goods. Do all people that sell stolen goods have to sell at below retail? If I did not buy it some other guy down the line would have jumped on the deal. My purchase of these goods has no correlation to stopping identity theft or stolen goods. Maybe the credit card companies should stop sending out those pre-approved credit cards? Or just think about how in the grand scheme, if this guy is a thief, my moral refusal to not purchase the goods would not prevent him from doing it again.

 

Should I just take the loss and turn all these over to the police? Officer I had this suspicion that I was scammed not that these were stolen, but after consulting with the internet they guided my moral compass to believe that all TGBT deals are stolen goods even without concrete proof. So hold on to these Legos just in case the rightful owner ever shows up to claim them.

 

@JRandall: He stated he needed to get his car fixed for work. Living in a place with horrible public transportation, I did not think that to be a horrible excuse. Selling Legos quickly but at a loss to fix a car is better than losing a job because you held on to Legos. Even if he held on to them it would have been a bit for him to make profit since these are new sets. Desperation in this economy drives people to do things they otherwise would not have. He did deposit the cash immediately into his bank account. I saw him walk to BofA before walking off towards his home.

 

Buying potentially stolen goods: All legos can be potentially stolen goods unless they come with a receipt that proves that the person you are buying it from was the original owner. So unless you ask for a copy of the receipt and an identity check from every third party you bought from you could have bought potential stolen goods even if it was at full value. See Johnwray's tampon analogy below.

 

But I do like your compliment. I did not know that my actions as one person committing one act could bring such a shadow upon this great community.

[justafrog]

Buying potentially (illegally purchased or stolen) makes everyone on the site look bad.  These aren't anything to be proud about unless the person is liquidating their collection of which this obviously isn't the case.

 

I do hate to be argumentative, but I look fabulous, today and every day.

 

Bottom line is, the OP doesn't know whether these "fell off a truck" or if the guy's telling the truth. He took a risk, and provided the next visitor at his house isn't Officer Friendly to discuss confiscating the stolen goods, it appears to have paid off for him.

 

I tend personally to avoid these TGTBT scenarios, but that's 99% because I am adverse to risk in general. I am certain I will miss out on some very good and very legitimate deals because of it, while at the same time avoiding the maybe-shady and definitely-shady ones that also come along.

 

There are all sorts of people who will be haters to investors and resellers on this site for all sorts of reasons. It's pointless to worry about how we "look" in every might-be-marginal situation. They can think what they want.

[johnwray]

The police have a different opinion than you do.  Receiving stolen goods, whether you know it or not, is illegal.  Ignorance of the law will not help you.  At the very least, if the cops track down the stolen property, they will take it as evidence and you're out all of your money.

 

Not true. This is from the Wikipedia page "Possession of Stolen Goods":

 

Possession of stolen goods is a crime in which an individual has bought, been given, or acquired stolen goods some other way (other than they themselves having stolen them).

 

In many countries, if an individual has accepted possession of goods or property and knew they were stolen, then the individual is typically charged with a misdemeanor or felony, depending on the value of the stolen goods. If the individual did not know the goods were stolen, then the goods are returned to the owner and the individual is not prosecuted. However, there are often exceptions, due to the difficulty of proving or disproving an individual's knowledge that the goods were stolen.

 

There are then several sections detailing the laws in different countries, but under the United States heading is this: 

 

To be guilty of the offense, a person must know that the property had been stolen, but he need not know that it was moving as, or constituted a part of, interstate commerce. The term "interstate commerce" merely refers to the movement of property from one U.S. state into another; and it is sufficient if the property has recently moved interstate as a result of a transaction or a series of related transactions that have not been fully completed or consummated at the time of the person's acts as alleged.

 

It is beyond impossible for people to know which things they buy are stolen and which aren't. If an owner of a convenience store steals a crate full of tampons and sells it in his store, there's no way a consumer could determine that. Cops aren't going to arrest some woman for buying stolen tampons. Are we supposed to ask everyone we buy anything from where they got it? They're not going to admit having stolen it even if they did. So are we supposed to trace every single thing we buy back to its source? Good luck with that. 

 

One might suspect that something is stolen, particularly if it's something cheap on Craigslist, but there are plenty of legitimate deals on Craigslist for non-stolen goods. We have no way of knowing and we have no responsibility to find out. If the dude says, "Hey, want to buy some Legos I boosted from a delivery truck?" THEN you're committing a crime by purchasing them. 

[vincevaughn]

Not true. This is from the Wikipedia page "Possession of Stolen Goods":

Possession of stolen goods is a crime in which an individual has bought, been given, or acquired stolen goods some other way (other than they themselves having stolen them).

In many countries, if an individual has accepted possession of goods or property and knew they were stolen, then the individual is typically charged with a misdemeanor or felony, depending on the value of the stolen goods. If the individual did not know the goods were stolen, then the goods are returned to the owner and the individual is not prosecuted. However, there are often exceptions, due to the difficulty of proving or disproving an individual's knowledge that the goods were stolen.

There are then several sections detailing the laws in different countries, but under the United States heading is this:

To be guilty of the offense, a person must know that the property had been stolen, but he need not know that it was moving as, or constituted a part of, interstate commerce. The term "interstate commerce" merely refers to the movement of property from one U.S. state into another; and it is sufficient if the property has recently moved interstate as a result of a transaction or a series of related transactions that have not been fully completed or consummated at the time of the person's acts as alleged.

It is beyond impossible for people to know which things they buy are stolen and which aren't. If an owner of a convenience store steals a crate full of tampons and sells it in his store, there's no way a consumer could determine that. Cops aren't going to arrest some woman for buying stolen tampons. Are we supposed to ask everyone we buy anything from where they got it? They're not going to admit having stolen it even if they did. So are we supposed to trace every single thing we buy back to its source? Good luck with that.

One might suspect that something is stolen, particularly if it's something cheap on Craigslist, but there are plenty of legitimate deals on Craigslist for non-stolen goods. We have no way of knowing and we have no responsibility to find out. If the dude says, "Hey, want to buy some Legos I boosted from a delivery truck?" THEN you're committing a crime by purchasing them.

Not even going to ask why of all things you used tampons as an example....

As far as this deal goes I am now convinced this was on the level. Walking several blocks with three huge lego sets would be a pain. So the car story checks out. Also most times residential areas are behind big box retailers so he may have been trying to save himself some walking distance. People are strange and he probably didnt even realize that meeting behind the store was a little suspect.

The low price fits into wanting a quick sale. I am sure he relies on his car to get him to a job hence needing the money quickly. Also to return them would have entailed shipping back to the company and waiting for processing and the money to be refunded to his card which would take some time.

I say he didn't plan on having car trouble and it hit him hard so he made a hard choice. I can even identify with this as last week my car decided to cost me a couple grand. Life happens and many people do not or cannot maintain rainy day funds.

[Pirate]

Please just close this thread. As it appears its just morally offensive to so many who live on their high horses who have never bought anything that could have once been stolen. Unlike the law, it appears to be guilty until proven innocent. I am sure me buying it as opposed to another person that post on a different site makes such a huge difference.

 

Give me a break. Even if you have never bought a deal that was TGBT it doesn't mean you have not unknowingly received stolen goods. Do all people that sell stolen goods have to sell at below retail? If I did not buy it some other guy down the line would have jumped on the deal. My purchase of these goods has no correlation to stopping identity theft or stolen goods. Maybe the credit card companies should stop sending out those pre-approved credit cards? Or just think about how in the grand scheme, if this guy is a thief, my moral refusal to not purchase the goods would not prevent him from doing it again.

 

 

Justifying your actions by saying if you hadn't done it, someone else would have is a fallacy.  It is self-serving, faulty logic.  

[HarryG]

That weight sounds right anyway because I'm pretty sure the net weight is 3,660 meaning the Lego only. The box would be that extra few grams. Can you reseal them? I would use a small amount of super glue but I'm not sure if that would do anything to the boxes?..

In my honest opinion you have done nothing wrong. The story you are told is all you have to judge the deal on. You got a great deal. If I saw Lego that heavily discounted I would buy it right away and take the persons word for it. Lego has no shame charging Australians nearly double what Americans pay (and well over the exchange rate) when its supposedly shipped from the same place so I would have no shame getting major discounts either

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[JRandall]

 

I just picked up three Lego Simpsons Houses for $140 each off of Craigslist. The whole time I was wondering if the deal was TGTBT, and when the guy wanted to meet at the back of Safeway I was ready to walk away.

I never claimed OP knew they were stolen, I just know that some people partake in the gray area when it comes to how they acquire their Lego's or whatever else they buy and sell(B&****** threads using exclusive coupons proves this, and Ebay sellers drop-shipping or selling 100's of cases of yet released Simpsons Minifigures), and the original statement by the OP leads me believe he wondered if something was up which was simply good judgement on his part considering an in demand item selling for 30+% below retail.

 

I've bought and sold on Craigslist for more than 7 years, and if any item was still in the package and offered to me for 30% below retail in new condition I would question if I'm about to enter a dangerous or suspect situations, be it an Ipod Touch, Xbox 360, or Lego toys.. and on top of that to have someone ask me to meet them behind a building I'd figure they are either hiding something or hoping to hold me up at gunpoint for some quick cash as they pass through town because this is typically how people of this nature operate.

 

Just glad OP is safe, but I believe it's extremely rare if non existent for deals of this type be on the up and up unless you're dealing in used goods.  Total score if the original owner did purchase them on a big discount with employee discount of some sort and you scored a great deal, but 9/10 times I'd believe the latter.

[Fcbarcelona101]

Gotta love senseless speculation.

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[golong]

Hi,

I am new to lego investing.  I have just started to build a portfolio and am having great fun.  Two sets that i particularly like and have been looking at are the new Simpsons house and the minecraft sets.  My personal views are that both of these could well be good long term investments.  I just wondered what peoples thoughts are and whether it would be sensible to buy now or wait.  What i do not know is whether these are the types of sets that are likely to be sold at reduced prices in the future.